The reason I’d like to try to install the Aldon is that I have now tried for 7 or 8 mornings to install the 123 without success. I have tried all the 8 combinations of attachment to the plugs - in addition to 1342, I’ve also tried 3421, 4213, and 2134. And in case (because of the direction of rotation of the rotor arm) 2431, 4312, 3124 and 1243. All without success. I don’t know what else to try. I do have a spark from all 4 plugs. I have also tried leaving the 123 just loose enough in its bracket to be able to turn it and have tried turning all the way to the right, all the way to the left, and halfway in between - no success. I have also checked that there is petrol arriving.
I am at a complete loss to know what to try next - hence my thoughts of trying the Aldon. But I’d prefer to have a set of Aldon instructions before I commence. As you may read I have emailed Aldon with a request they supply me same - but no reply.
Very helpful reply! It has a plate screwed onto it that reads “Aldon Automotive Ltd” but perhaps its really a Pertronix. Either way I’d like to receive instructions before I try to install it.
Those instructions should help, but remember that the rotor arm runs anticlockwise and the fact you have a spark at each plug suggests your ignition is working okay. So follow up on Phil’s advice and once set up the car should run. If not, then I wonder whether you have another problem.
I have been in touch with the manufacturers of my 123Ignition (at [email protected]) who have confirmed that as I’m getting a spark my distributor must be working O.K. They can’t see what I’m doing wrong… So I’m going to try again. I will you know what happens next.
I have just sent an email to 123Ignition telling what I’ve done today:-
“Hello again.
This afternoon I tried again. I began by putting a pencil down plug hole n°1 and raising to its highest point, checking that the cam visible through the oil cap was pointing towards the other side and facing slightly down to be sure I wasn’t 180° out, as per instructions on a Lotus Elan forum. I replaced the spark plugs with brand new ones for good measure.
I ensured that the green light was shining through one of the 4 holes. On this issue, does WHICH hole it shines through have an significance please?
I then put the plug leads into the “1324” order and tried to start the car, without success. I then very slightly slackened the bolt holding the distributor so that it could just about be turned, turning it completely to the right, completely to the left, and halfway between, each time trying to start the car at each distributor position. All without success.
I then completed this whole process for each of “3421”, “4213” and “2134” in case my distributor was one cylinder out of alignment. All without success.
Finally I took one of the plugs out to check that there was a spark, and there was.
I really don’t know what else to try.
Is there anything else you suggest trying please. Where am I going wrong?
Many thanks
Anthony”
I really am at a complete loss to know what to do next. Can anyone see where I’ve gone wrong please?
Many thanks
I have read through this topic and there is no mention that you have checked and confirmed that fuel is reaching the cylinders. There was recently another long-running, non-start topic, that was finally resolved by adding fuel to the tank.
You are perfectly correct, there is no mention that there is petrol getting through, but in fact (unfortunately!) both the breakdown man when the Lumention distributor suddenly died and also myself have checked that there is indeed arriving. Both the breakdown man and I partially removed the tube arriving from the petrol tank and there was indeed petrol leaking from the tube.
I am bemused why you are changing the firing order. It is 1342 and does not need to be changed as a troubleshooting exercise. The distributor goes anti clockwise so ensure you have the plug leads set to 1342 anti clockwise with no.1 cylinder being the front.
Then check that the cams on no. 4 cylinder are both pointing down but towards each other.
Then move the distributor such the rotor arm is pointing to no.1 cylinder. Check this by looking inside the cap to make sure its correct, not by just looking at the outside of the cap.
If all this is correct then you have set the timing to TDC, ie 0 degrees advance. You know need to set the advance you require, probably 10 degrees before TDC.
If you have sparks and fuel then it should now fire.
Just go through the steps carefully to make sure you’re not making an error somewhere. As 123 have explained, if it’s sparking it’s not the distributor but the set up.
When checking with your pencil, did you check that the notch in the front pulley was pointing to TDC. Even if the rotor arm is not exactly in the right position, the odd degree of two should still allow the engine to start and run, so you can then fine tune the timing. When you remove the spark plugs after attempting a start are they wet or dry, if the latter then the fuel is not reaching the cylinder chamber.
Once you have done these checks, report back so we can take the next logical step
>>>Dave “If all this is correct then you have set the timing to TDC, ie 0 degrees advance. You know need to set the advance you require, probably 10 degrees before TDC.” Please could you tell how to set the advance to 10 degrees before TDC.
>>>Donels “I am bemused why you are changing the firing order. It is 1342 and does not need to be changed as a troubleshooting exercise.” The reason I tried all the other orders (“3421”, “4213” and “2134”) is because I wasn’t absolutely certain that the rotor arm was indeed pointing towards n°1 terminal and thus plug.
>>>Tony “When you remove the spark plugs after attempting a start are they wet or dry, if the latter then the fuel is not reaching the cylinder chamber.” The plugs are indeed dry, and yet there is definitely a supply of petrol, as per my reply to Mike. Before the break-down, caused I believe, by the sudden failure of the Lumenition distributor, the petrol pump was working just fine. Can petrol pumps just suddenly fail? In addition to the standard mechanical petrol pump I do have an electric fuel pump mounted near the petrol tank that I use when the car hasn’t been started for a week or so to prime the carburettors. I run it for 30 seconds or so, turn it off and let the mechanical petrol pump take over. I could try leaving the electric fuel pump running next time I attempt to start the car to see if that makes a difference. Also, is there another way of seeing whether petrol is getting to the carburettors? Anything I could dismantle on the carburettors to see whether they contain any petrol?
Many many thanks to you all - you are all being amazingly helpful!
Look at the front pulley on which there is a notch.
Look on the front timing cover behind the pulley, there are marks on there for TDC, 10, 20,30 degrees.
To set the timing at either TDC or any of the other degrees you need to turn the engine first anticlockwise about a 1/4 of a revolution.
Now slowly turn the pulley clockwise to bring the notch on the pulley round to the 10 degree mark, you are now set at the correct position (providing you have checked the lobe on the camshaft is pointing towards the middle of the engine and slightly downwards).
Set your distributor to the No 1 plug lead or as instructed in the printed matter you have.
Now your second problem,
If you undo the wing nut on top of each carb you can use someting like a lollipop stick to dip into the carb float bowl to check for fuel. Before you start mark the stick 25mm from the end
Slowly dip the stick until the mark is level with the top of the carb, remove the stick and see if there is any signs of fuel on it.
If not then do it again and push the stick further in , each time removing the stick to check for fuel.
This is a rough check but your float bowl should have sufficient fuel to wet the stick at about the 25mm level.
If there is fuel then we need to think about the next check.
Accelerator Pump Check
You will perhaps now need to remove the airbox cover to see into the trumpet on each carb.
Shine a torch into the first trumpet and rapidly open the throttle three/four times and see if you can see any fuel around the butterfly area of the throat
You may need to try and get a finger down into there for this check, or cut some long strips of paper to slide inside the each of the carbs with the butterfly open to do this. Remember to open the butterfly when removing the paper as hopefully the papers should be wet or at least damp
This should tell us whether the accelerator pump in the carb is injecting fuel into the engine for the car to get an initial charge of fuel.
Another option you might try is a good squirt of Easy Start into each carb trumpet and try to start
Let us know how you get on, but set timing before doing carbs.
Tony and Tony, that is a good and precise description and should be very helpful. I just have one thing to add. I have Weber 151 carbs on my S3 and the fuel level is set at 29mm from the top of the chamber, or 41mm from the rim of the cover. It does sound like lack of fuel at this stage.
For the second problem (petrol getting to the carbs) I have Strombergs, not Webers, so what you suggest doesn’t apply. Does anyone know how to check if petrol is getting through to Strombergs, please?
I have printed out your instructions for setting the timing and will attempt that soon.
I was unable to understand what to do regarding petrol getting through to the carbs, but I thought of a simpler method. I disconnected the tube coming from the petrol pump and then briefly turned over the engine. There was petrol everywhere! So petrol is definitely being pumped towards the carbs. Anything wrong with my logic, please?