1970 Elan S4 SE DHC ground up

Elan Discussions
1

So I just became an Elan owner again (1970 S4 SE DHC) after a gap of 27 years (1971 S4 SE FHC/1969 S4 SE DHC/1973 +2S 4 speed). The car needs a complete restoration and this site has given me some great ideas and guidance. One subject which I can’t seem to see any threads on is the following:

Assuming the car is to be completely stripped down and will be re-painted is it best to have the body painted off the chassis or to fit the body to the chassis after all the mechanical wiork is done and then re-paint the car?

I can see props and cons both ways but I am leaning towards painting on the chassis as it seems to me that there is a good chance of damaging the new paint job on the way back from the shop and/or in fitting the body.

Looking forward to feedback.

2

When I did my elan (almost 30 years ago now :exclamation: :exclamation: ) I mounted the body on the rolling chassis to enable easy handling by paint shop and minimise risk of body damage.

I had done all the structural repairs to the body and the paint shop only needed to do surface prep and paint so no need for access to areas covered by chassis. I painted the engine bay myself before mounting on chassis.

cheers
Rohan

3

With a Body on paint job the Paint shop will make a big mess of all your shiny mechanical bits.
They’ll want the Doors, Bonnet & Boot lid off the car & they will be happier being able to lift just the Body up to a more comfortable working height.
Whilst all that’s being done you can also work in comfort on the chassis, suspension etc. etc.
There’s no good argument to do it any other way unless you find it totally impossible to get the Body only to the paint shop.

Good luck
John

4

my paint shop masked off the wheel arches and bonnet area and inside car so no overspray on body or mechanical parts. I kept the doors, boot bonnet separate for them to paint

cheers
Rohan

5

I would suggest that if you intend taking the body off the chassis then paint it while its off. It’s much easier than trying to mask everything up.

You can always tape bubble wrap onto the exposed areas such as wheel arches to minimise the chance of damage while fitting the body.

6

It is all down to how YOU wish to do it. I do tend to agree with John, although I would because that was how I did it. As John said there is no reason at all why not. I took my car’s body from Fife in Scotland to Option 1 (bromsgrove nr Birmingham) in a borrowed pick up. Went back about 14 weeks later and brought it back up in the same pickup. With good care you should not have any damage. Whilst the completely stripped body was away I started on the rebuild. I had the chassis rolling and awaiting the body when it was ready. I had EVERYTHING to do. I got away with nothing.

Up to you but If I was doing it again ( :open_mouth: ) I would do it the same way. It allows superb access etc. I sat for a day or two in my engine bay soldering up all the connections for eg… Very difficult to do normally.

You are only going to do this once (to this car!) hopefully. Full strip down and I do mean FULL strip down in my humble opinion is the correct way. But as I always say… To each their own…

You can follow my escapades in ‘New Car arriving’ post about a year or so ago now… Great fun! I had a blast. I blew a flaming big hole in my bank A/C… :laughing: :laughing:

Best wishes and good luck with it. You have come to the right place for help and advice. Not to mention councelling :laughing: :laughing:

:laughing:

Just have fun and enjoy… And keep us all posted…

Alex B… :sunglasses:

7

Great feedback - thanks. I am certainly going to remove the body and fully strip the car (believe me it needs it) but the question is whether once I have the chassis/motor/tranny etc all refurbished do I then 1) fit the body back as is and have it painted or 2) do I take the body separately to the shop to have it painted and then fit it to the by then perfect chassis etc?

In the case of 2) I am really worried that I risk cracks in the newly painted bodywork as I tighten it onto the chassis and that’s assuming I get the painted shell back and fitted to the chassis without damaging it. The only risk inherent in 1) seems to be overspray which I am not too concerned about as the guy doing the repaint is very careful.

Of course it has snowed in CT today so it looks as if I will have to wait another week to pick up the car.

8

I wasn’t really referring to overspray when I wrote about messing up all your shiny bits, but all of the dust that is created when preparing the Body for paint. It just gets everywhere.
I think that you should forget your worries about cracking the Body; it’s how the Car was assembled originally & I’ve not read of anyone on this Forum having such problems.
If in doubt ask your Paint Shop which option they’d prefer, that should answer your question from the Horses Mouth as they say.

Cheers
John

9

Your body work if properly repaired and painted. (various companies will do this very well and give you a warranty) should not be that fragile. With care, you are unlikely to damage it just refitting it. If you think that it will ‘crack’ just by tightening onto the chassis, I would suggest that properly done this is just NOT a risk. If it were so, I would give it 5 Min’s on the road before it was wrecked. I got a 24 month warranty with mine. Not wear and tear etc. But g/teed not to craze / crack. If it does it goes back to option 1 for rectification.

Most if not all of the really good companies will prefer to have the body off the frame.It is MUCH easier to do the repairs and painting properly. Call them! Ask the questions. The engine compartment of my car was superb when I got it back. Just not possible to do the same job with an engine in the way (for eg)… You are going to have the body off anyway! Why not send it for resto then??? If you were not removing the body etc… Well that’s a different matter. I would then def’ send it as a rolling /driving car.

Try talking to Frank at option 1… option1sportscars.co.uk And I’m not on commission. Unfortunately :confused:

Whilst it is away do the chassis etc. Re-unite the two when you are ready… Body on trestles is a great way to do a fair mount of the refit. New loom? hanging the doors? etc… Easy job!

To each their own though…

Alex B… :sunglasses:

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10

I have had a few painted and all needed every last nut, bolt, rivit, screw and what ever else removed. Your decription is a bit lacking as to the condition of the 40 year old fiberglass Elan. Either way they are a lot of work. I have had them painted off the body, papered and masked the newly painted shell and then blacked out the underside boot and area under the bonnet. the shell bolted back on without issues. Use spacers if there is a gap between the chassis and body, do not just tighten until tight. What kind of conditions is the chassis, sounds like you are in New England (snowing here as I write this). I think you really need to get the Elan home and get the body off before you can say which way to do it. If you find that the chassis is better off being replaced, you will need to mount the body twice. Come up to Scituate if you want to look at some work in progress (its not progressing any more) so you can wait for better weather. 100miles or 2 hours from the CT/RI border.

Gary

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Sorry. I thought you were in the UK. The consequence of minimalistic profile information.

Why not just say where and who you are? Do we call you DP? 87? or just champs?? :confused:

Beats me!

Alex B…

12

Two reasons I am buying the car:

  1. CA car for almost all its life and the chassis is in really good condition. I had it up on a lift for over an hour poking around. Vacuum holds too.
  2. The motor was just rebuilt 500 miles ago (properly) by Mike at Stonebridge Sports and Classics.

However, the body work is horrible but no accident damage as far as we can tell. Someone did a junk respray a few years ago and huge chunks of paint are flaking off. There are very few spiders or cracks though.

Seems like speaking to the body guy is my best course (why didn’t I think of that!)

Gary, I may well take you up on your offer - thanks.

Alex, sorry will fill in the profile now but name is David and I am in CT although originally from Dumfriesshire in your fair country.

13

David,
I live in Grafton Ma, just south of Worcester and am in the middle of a frame off restoration on a 72 Elan Sprint. Body is off and at my body shop, new frame has been powder coated and running gear is in place. This is my 4th frame off so if I can be of help feel free to drop me a note or stop by and see my current project or my 3 previous efforts all in this area.
I would agree with the others that a frame off makes a lot of sense if for no other reason than to discover all the hidden flaws (areas of the frame not visable or serviceable until exposed, hard brake lines, rotted frame padding), and easier fiberglass repair and suspension reassemby. Care in mating the refurbished body to the frame is not as stressfull as it might sound and should not put the refinished body at risk is carefull.
Best of luck with your project.

Rick

14

Hello David,
That’s better eh?

Cool choice of car. Best of luck with it. Please keep us updated with the progress.

Scotland in winter!!! Nah! I am going to go off on and book a cruise! Bahamas sound like a good idea.

Cheers. have fun with it.

Alex B…

15

I will post some ‘before’ pictures once the snow melts and the roads dry sufficiently to drive it the 30 miles from Mike’s garage. The last full restoration I did was on my Lotus 69 Formula Ford so it will be interesting to see how this one compares. Lots more stuff can be wrong on a road car but almost everything does seem to work on it.

The one sure thing is the cost will be over budget!

David

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:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: Oh yes!

Start saving now… :wink:

Alex…

17

I’ll be the contrarian here. Why take the body off if the chassis is “in really good condition”? If its just the paint that needs addressing, just address the paint. I went more the rolling restoration route, which has allowed me to enjoy the car and chip away as time and money permits. It probably depends on how you like to tackle projects like this, head on and bit by bit. I know its cold now (just south of you in Baltimore), but spring will be here before you know it and you know you will want to drive it. Just another point of view, something you will come to learn that there are a lot of on this site. Either way you go, it will be a great project. Looking forward to the pictures, Dan '70 S4 SE DHC

18

David, I think Dan above hits the nail on the head. If full inspection of the frame indicates you are comfortable not removing the body, so be it; paint in place. I thought I could go that route with my Plus 2, but it turned out a new frame was required when we inspected things more closely.

If, as you indicate, you are removing the body for sure, I would prep & paint with it off. This worked well for me. The access to various areas of the body is much better, and the paint shop could easily handle the body on a steel cart. He also put an undercoating material in various areas, which was way easier as a raw body. For hauling the body around finished, I rented an enclosed auto hauler trailer with smooth floor, which worked very well. They have a smooth surface ramp type door with a very gentle slope and low approach angle, which made loading & unloading of the body reasonable when supported on castor pads. No real risk of damage rolling the body on & off.

Anyway, removal of the body is the key. It adds a considerable amount of work, but assures all is good with the frame and facilitates a lot of work, like fitting brake lines, hand brake cable, diff & shafts, etc.

One thing I did not realize at the start of the project was the amount of storage space & work space required. The complete body located off site for a considerable period of time during prep & paint ended up helping a lot. I am in snow country as well, and using my wife’s side of the garage to store the body off the car was not an option, and leaving it out in the weather even covered does not seem to be recommended. I got a shed to store all the various components while off the car or out of the frame, which worked well.

With the body back, I am just at the assembly stage now. Body off the frame is making access considerably easier. I have most of the separate components ready to go and stored in the basement; rebuilt heater, light pods, dash with wiring attached, flushed gas tank, etc… My plan is to essentially build up most of the body with the rolling chassis complete with drive train now safely stored off site and out of the way.

Obviously to each is own, but that`s the way I am doing it.

Here is a link to some photo’s of the body work showing the cart he used. You can see the Ali square tubing frame I installed at the Plus 2 jacking points located in the side rails, I believe the Elan is a bit different in this detail, and the body would just rest on the flat cart top.

halerconcepts.com/1971_lotus … ts_ltd.htm

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Here is a link to the ‘before’ pictures. Hope the link works.
picasaweb.google.com/lh/sredir?u … feat=email

David

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David, my .02:
Don’t paint it this season – it’ll never be ready for the summer.
Drive it and take it down end of next season.
Whatever you estimate it’ll take, you can probably double it.
PS: I’m about 1/2 hr from you – reach out if I can help. I just did the bodywork on this one, by hand.

Chris

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