Prices are dropping

Hi

Just came across this S4 that was auctioned recently. Only made £15750! (Plus buyer’s premium of £1575)

swva.co.uk/classic-car/lotu … e-s4-1970/

Then this one on C&C: carandclassic.com/l/C1789649 - £19995.

I thought a good S4 was £30k territory. I guess the “cost of living crisis” is having a real effect. So I reckon - asking prices notwithstanding - that the days of the £40k Sprint are gone. At least, for now.

JonB

yes, it looks rather decent (even if too yellow to my taste, and a Stromberg head but with the top balancer tube), a cracked valve cover and torn/reglued driver seat alone would not explain such a price cut if the demand was not faltering…

As luck would have it, the Elan and all Lotus products are not VW Beatles or 911’s.

Hemmings here in the USA shows values and overall it seems many cars are worth a little less. Watching Mecum auctions on TV and thought there were some pretty good deals. Guess people are just a little tight right now, even the well off.

Yes you are correct, prices falling everywhere.

I think due to the type of government (sic) we have in the UK people are holding on to their cash. If you have any, this govenment will want to relieve you of as much of it as it can. To use an old quote “it spends other peoples money until there is none left”

Better put the heating on it’s cold… oh wait, I forgot…

sorry for the “offtopic”

Mark,I think you have a point. The upcoming budget is surely weighing on people’s minds and all new governments like to put up taxes as soon as they get into office, whatever their political persuasion. At least in the U.K.

An observed behaviour of the wealthy is the tendency to lock wealth into assets but as far as high end classics are concerned I do not know what the market is currently like. They are exempt from CGT so the top of the market examples can be a good investment.

Interesting read here : georgehay.co.uk/blogs/2019/ … assic-car/

That said I think prices in our market segment have been getting worse for a year at least. I suppose it’s obvious when you see all the overpriced adverts for the same cars popping up again and again!

Possibly true, but I am seeing prices of cars from the late 1980s and 1990s rising strongly at the mo. So I think we are also observing a generation shift to what we call modern classics. Which may mean, inevitably, that 1960s and 1970s classic loose value. Cars fro. The 1950s experienced similar drops a decade ago.
Tim

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A very good point, shynsy.

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Vehicles that have one or more issues do have lower price. But it is my opinion the the truly exceptional cars restored to perfection are still bring the money!!! At least here in the USA.

Frank

Yes the nostalgia window is definitely a factor when considering to whom these cars appeal… interesting topic

Sold my Elan 4 years ago for not much. Would love to replace it but agree that well maintained or restored examples command a higher price.

It seems to me that there’s just too few sales to really know what’s happening with Elan values. A person could be on this site for a month or more without an offering popping up. There’s been a small handful of high-dollar cars on BAT (all from the same restorer) but I’m not sure that says much about the market. Same for the low sales mentioned here.

One things for certain, the Lotus demographic is pretty old. Rarely, at 52, do I consider myself a young guy. Among vintage Lotus drivers, I qualify as that. At Porsche and VW events I attend, I see lots of guys in their 20s and 30s, which may keep the prices up. When I’ve taken my Elan or Seven to a cars and coffee, most people have no idea what it is. Too bad there’s no Luftgekuhlt or Rennsport Reunion for Lotus cars. Or even a strong magazine dedicated to the cars, unless I’ve missed it?

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52, & i am not gonna catch ya close though
I figure the Elań thing is not main stream, and either you have to of been brought home from the hospital in one or have paid real close attention or both.
I also don’t think there’s much hope for anyone under the age of 50 anyway, Because of social media, and that they never had to open a parts book.
I will say this however and I suspect it would be the case that if you could stuff a 2025 Toyota Yaris GR three cylinder 500 hp six speed sequential into a Elań you should be able to sell it for 300,000.
I believe the market is less about vintage originality for anyone that didn’t grow up with a car and more about ease of operation, most want to be able to plug a computer in and replace a module and keep going rather than trying to figure out if it’s a bad ground or other carburetter problem.

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As I look at the spiralling cost of my restoration, even pricing my time at zero, its pretty clear that I would have done better economically to purchase a restored example. It is of course not why I am doing it, but restored cars seem to be available below replacement cost.

h20hamelan: I believe the market is less about vintage originality for anyone that didn’t grow up with a car and more about ease of operation, most want to be able to plug a computer in and replace a module and keep going rather than trying to figure out if it’s a bad ground or other carburetter problem.

Jay Leno made an interesting point on one of his podcasts, cars with ‘application specific electronics’ (modules specific to a particular car) will not be maintainable when the manufacturer stops supplying replacement parts.

At a push, absent grinding the crankshaft, making roller and ball bearings and the castings, I think I could have a go at making (or at least repairing) most things in an Elan if I really had to. If I couldn’t do it, then I am sure a competent machine shop could. That would not be possible with modern car electronics, particularly electronics with embedded software. That 2005 Ferrari you have in the garage won’t be drivable in 2030 when the engine management system has packed up and Ferrari don’t have spares anymore for 25 year old cars. Anyone buying a ‘modern classic’ built much past the early 90s is likely to eventually end up with an undrivable relic. As this dawns on buyers, I think the prices of ‘modern classics’ are likely to collapse.

Likely, but, aftermarket engine management has saved many. While this is true, not about body cabin controls which do get exhausting, many of them are & will be useless, but, all can be made to work even if it’s just an up and down function. I am also fairly confident A.I in writing body control module programs will get easier for the rare 1998 to 2014 cars. II think there anre only a few in there like you mentioned Ferrari that will be worth the effort because the cars are not made as well.

I think the majority of Elan owners are mature in years👨‍🦰and I therefore think the 80/90s cars are the nostalgia fix of the 40 somethings who hark back to their youth and what was cool and perhaps out of reach back in the day?

That trend has been remarked on over the past couple of years in many articles.

I do not think there is a gloomy outlook for our cars, both Elans and 60s/70s classics. We just happen to be in a dip at the moment. How long it lasts is another matter.

However, I am optimistic that younger folk will come along and appreciate our cars. I have three grandsons, 18, 4 and 2. They all want to inherit my Sprint! And look at the VSCC. Many younger people getting involved in 20s/30s cars, trialling them and enjoying fettling them. Back in the 1980s it was really quite tricky to pick up some Elan spares, unlike today when almost all of our requirements are being met by specialists, thankfully.

I view the glass as half full!

Tim

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Sample size of one here, but I purchased a Plus 2 for my 30th last year, We do exist! Nearly everyone who I talk to expresses some desire for something similar, however there is always some reason why it wouldnt work for them, be it impracticality, cost, fear of maintenence, etc.
A second point is that 80’s and 90’s cars have a driveability aspect that makes a big difference in modern traffic.

There seem to be a lot of cars still priced at a lockdown premium, as noted a consequence of this is cars on the market for a year or more. This is not just Lotus Elans obviously.
Demographics aside, I think the economy is going to struggle this year and the lack of confidence may well slow general discretionary purchase as we might expect.
Without going on a political rant, there is now some talk that cash Isa’s may be amended, maybe a lower limit that are no longer tax exempt. This may push some funds into classic cars, maybe on the assumption they are still exempt from capital gains tax, for now!